Two Excellent Interviews on The New Apostolic Reformation

Photo Credit C. Peter Wagner via NPR.org

In case anyone is interested and you haven’t come across these interviews yet, they are definitely worth a listen:

My blogger buddy and friend Freeatlast and I have been listening to a couple interviews on NPR by Terry Gross on Fresh Air about the NAR - the New Apostolic Reformation led by C. Peter Wagner - its mission and possible effect on American politics. One of the online articles opens with:

A new charismatic Christian movement that seeks to take dominion over politics, business and culture in preparation for the end times and Jesus’ return is becoming more of a presence in American politics. The leaders are considered apostles and prophets, gifted by God for this role. Several apostles affiliated with the movement helped organize or spoke at Rick Perry’s August prayer rally, The Response.

 Listening gives you even more insight than reading the articles (the articles being only a summary). The first interview is with Rachel Tabachnick, who discusses the growing influence of the NAR in the political world. She has been researching and writing about the apostles for a decade and has her own blog call NARWatch and contributes to another blog called Talk To Action. The second interview is with Peter Wagner himself - his quiet grandfatherly tones leave you wondering how such a nice man came to pick up the idea that he has been appointed by God as Christianity’s modern day Apostle when he actually spent 30 years as a professor at Fuller Theological Seminary so it’s not like he hasn’t studied the scriptures. Somewhere along the line he decided his interpretation of scripture contains new revelation. (hmmm- who does that remind you of? Oh ya, Joseph Smith!) He’s been the mentor and leader to certain special prophets in the NAR such as Dutch Sheets, Cindy Jacobs, Chuck Pierce and Lou Engle. They have been, and could be still, considered ‘under his authority’. He says they are aligned apostolically. His resume also includes Co-founder of the World Prayer Center in Colorado Springs with Ted Haggard. And oh yes, that is part of the discussion in the interview you won’t want to miss.

One more thing - the interview touches on 40 days of light over DC as something these folks are involved in so i looked it up and found this from RightWingWatch.org:

John Benefiel, Cindy Jacobs, and others will be returning to DC this fall for forty days of prayer through something called “DC 40: Forty Days of Light Over D.C” through which they will lay spiritual “seige” to the city and the nation in general -

The organizers say this about it: 

The purpose of this siege is to change the atmosphere over the city of Washington D.C. through our worship, preparing the way for our legislators to function on a different playing field as we release 40 days of light over the city.

I know they think they mean well - but spiritual siege? Just saying - these types are serious in their agenda to change what it means to be a Christian. Maybe those who beg to differ should stage a different kind of “Occupy” protest to distinguish true believers of the original gospel from those who take great liberty to rewrite scripture and appoint themselves as Apostles of our faith.

House of Cards. . .

One of the hardest parts about leaving a controlling environment is watching the entity still continue on in their quest for dominion. They continue to exist, for one thing, which is bad enough because we now know that they are Dominionists who believe that they are going to inherit the hard-earned money of those in the world who have no clue that this is why they working so hard for their money. If the organization itself no longer existed maybe they'd figure out they aren't here to take over the world any time soon and their building could be used for something else like a charter school or a post office.

If the Dominionists were only delusional and not so harmful to others, then I'd have no problem with them staying in business. But when they continue to exert their control using spiritual manipulation over the fine people that remain, then it's hard to keep quiet.

Some of those fine people we randomly run into at the store. I must say, some of them can be really nice, politely acting like nothing ever happened even though we can still feel the pity through their kindness since in their minds we are the crazy ones. There are others, however, that treat us like we are the untouchables, no longer acceptable, since we deserted their camp. You know the type, they either pretend they don’t see you (which actually works out best) or, if they deign to speak, it’s with a hint of condescension and distain. They are judgmental and patronizing, with a smile, in the most aggravating way. These are the types you would leave town because of to start a new life in a new city. It’s actually a clue to us that the worship-fest for the pastor family is still going on over there which means not much has changed.

If nothing has changed, why does God still allow it to still continue? Lucky for them, His forbearance has depths we can’t even fathom. I readily admit he’s been extremely patient with those of us who have left. He doesn't rush us to hurry and get over it, giving us time to heal, as he guides us toward more and more truth that helps us understand what we endured when we were there. So, God, not being a respecter of persons, must be holding out till he absolutely has to do something to stop the bad behavior over there.

Waiting for God to deal with former world is a bit like waiting to see if the bail outs help the American Economy. I guess only time will tell.